I think the rescission will pass, barring something seismic. The Conservatives never did support the loan, and Reform are fully committed to rescission and can't very well row back without looking silly. They've got Richard Tice to make them look ridiculous, they've got that covered.
A new airport.... South Yorkshire Airport City?
- Thread starter mdobuk21
- Start date
Speedbird1
Active Member
Looks like Tice has already rejected the offer to go back to the private market this year if they don’t vote to rescind the loan.
In other news, the desperation of Spanners continues as he’s now claiming that Reform will cost the council £48m and send the council into bankruptcy. Surely any sane person can see that this wouldn’t be the fault of Reform but the reckless use of public funds by CDC in spending cash they didn’t have. It’s mind blowing that some of these people continue with a narrative that is so hypocritical and ultimately leads to more questions than answers…..then again looking at his latest garage accounts he’s not the smartest with accountancy.
Egyptian King
Active Member
In thr board papers along with not reaching any viable numbers before ros dies
Ros has handed control to symca under proposals
Ros has handed control to symca under proposals
Last edited:
Finger66
Well-Known Member
The spanner man is clearly a "jack" of all trades who is trying to "ramp" up support for a dead duck. A dead duck that will have no scheduled "services". Stick to what you know pal, if indeed you know anything as we are all getting "tyred" of your narrative
Did anyone read this?
www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk
"In 2024, a process started before the Superior Lease was signed, this Council ran a standard two-stage public procurement. The Superior Lease was then shared with final-stage bidders, and rigorous due diligence was undertaken.
"The conclusion was unambiguous: there was no private-sector appetite for primary investment at that point."
In other words, the smartest aviation investors in the world looked at it and ran a mile. The private sector realised it was a financial death-trap, so Jones decided Donny's taxpayers should foot the bill instead!
That has to be the most damning admission of this whole sorry saga and the mayor seems to think it's something to brag about.
And it gets better. Her "Offer to Reform" is a trap. She's offering to run a "Soft Market Test" for private investment this year, but insists it must be done "in parallel with the existing programme and decisions"! :-D
Translation: "Let me carry on with my £57m taxpayer-funded super-binge and I promise I'll make a few phone calls to see if any private investors magically change their minds." It's a conjob, designed to survive the rescission vote. If Reform fall for it, they're stuffed.
People deserve to know facts, says Mayor in lengthy letter on airport crisis
Mayor of Doncaster Ros Jones has launched a lengthy attack on Reform UK over the airport loan crisis, saying: “The residents of Doncaster deserve to know the facts.”
www.doncasterfreepress.co.uk
"In 2024, a process started before the Superior Lease was signed, this Council ran a standard two-stage public procurement. The Superior Lease was then shared with final-stage bidders, and rigorous due diligence was undertaken.
"The conclusion was unambiguous: there was no private-sector appetite for primary investment at that point."
In other words, the smartest aviation investors in the world looked at it and ran a mile. The private sector realised it was a financial death-trap, so Jones decided Donny's taxpayers should foot the bill instead!
That has to be the most damning admission of this whole sorry saga and the mayor seems to think it's something to brag about.
And it gets better. Her "Offer to Reform" is a trap. She's offering to run a "Soft Market Test" for private investment this year, but insists it must be done "in parallel with the existing programme and decisions"! :-D
Translation: "Let me carry on with my £57m taxpayer-funded super-binge and I promise I'll make a few phone calls to see if any private investors magically change their minds." It's a conjob, designed to survive the rescission vote. If Reform fall for it, they're stuffed.
GolfFox
Active Member
- Apr 14, 2014
- 442
- 113
That's interesting. Attempting to spread the anticipated financial loss? Does she want SYMCA to take a financial interest? On the face of it it would seem daft to relinquish 'control' but retain the financial liability?
I have not read any reports but a friend usually in the know mentioned that this company had suspended operations from MME. However as an airline it would seem unusual for them to invest in their own integrator at start up especially on someone else's land together with all the uncertainty.
Last edited:
- Jan 16, 2009
- 2,833
- 233
- Moderator
- #4,187
No company is investing in integrator facilities, that investment would fall to the land owner of lease holder. It won’t be European and I understand they have restarted flights to Teesside (could be wrong). Whoever they claim it is seems to already have a local operation. The claim that they could save £20 million per year is a rounding error when it comes to scaleable cargo networks. The fact they’ve mentioned it now, but can’t name names in spite of the apparent lack of interest in other airports means it’s likely mostly hot air designed to make reform and others think twice.
Absolutely. People used to talk about AENA and how they might be interested, I wouldn’t be surprised if they looked at it and then noticed LBA! As they’ve just recently taken the contracting shares in LBA.Did anyone read this?
People deserve to know facts, says Mayor in lengthy letter on airport crisis
Mayor of Doncaster Ros Jones has launched a lengthy attack on Reform UK over the airport loan crisis, saying: “The residents of Doncaster deserve to know the facts.”
"In 2024, a process started before the Superior Lease was signed, this Council ran a standard two-stage public procurement. The Superior Lease was then shared with final-stage bidders, and rigorous due diligence was undertaken.
"The conclusion was unambiguous: there was no private-sector appetite for primary investment at that point."
In other words, the smartest aviation investors in the world looked at it and ran a mile. The private sector realised it was a financial death-trap, so Jones decided Donny's taxpayers should foot the bill instead!
That has to be the most damning admission of this whole sorry saga and the mayor seems to think it's something to brag about.
And it gets better. Her "Offer to Reform" is a trap. She's offering to run a "Soft Market Test" for private investment this year, but insists it must be done "in parallel with the existing programme and decisions"! :-D
Translation: "Let me carry on with my £57m taxpayer-funded super-binge and I promise I'll make a few phone calls to see if any private investors magically change their minds." It's a conjob, designed to survive the rescission vote. If Reform fall for it, they're stuffed.
It’s a point we’ve made to death here, of the airport industry aren’t interested, then they aren’t interested for a reason. RCA would have seemed the most logical fit, they’ve actually formally opposed it in their submission to the Subsidy Advice Unit. They said there’s an abundance of private finance for airports in the U.K., but clearly at the airports that are viable. Ros Jones and her cabal are running a con. The senior managers at DSA are looking to be on a cushy gravy train number. It will fail, it will also take £millions with it.
AENA were clear in their briefing note that a key consideration for both NCL and LBA was the fact that they were both freehold assets. The lease around DSA will be a constant millstone around DSA. https://www.aena.es/sites/Satellite...goBlobs&blobwhere=1576872947180&ssbinary=true
Whilst I doubt a compulsory purchase order would be successful I can see the rationale for it and would question why folks have said this is a change of direction in policy for reform re DSA. It would seem CDC having full ownership is a prerequisite to getting private investor on board….
Whilst I doubt a compulsory purchase order would be successful I can see the rationale for it and would question why folks have said this is a change of direction in policy for reform re DSA. It would seem CDC having full ownership is a prerequisite to getting private investor on board….
- Jan 16, 2009
- 2,833
- 233
- Moderator
- #4,190
It is my belief that the council know a CPO would be expensive. I also believe they know there’s a high likelihood of the failure reoccurring and so it’s perhaps not in their long term interests to own the land outright. There may be skepticism of Peel (some of which warranted, but not regarding their motives for closing the airport!) but Peel do have a strong track record when it comes to delivering. If the land was owned by the council and the airport failed it would be land owned by the council and not by a successful regeneration investor/facilitator.
Doing things like calling it ‘the peoples airport’ is a basic politically motivated socialist belief manifesting. They believe in state control, this is fine but it flies in the face of the industry in the U.K. and the airports because privatised here for good reason - not enough available capital to expand as required! Which brings us back to the first point, the council must know by now that access to funding is finite and certainly won’t enable the growth they claim is achievable. So who pays?
His 48.7 Million post on facebook has a AI INFO in the top left corner..
clearly scrambling around and desperation ringing a bell
Speedbird1
Active Member
His desperation will grow now that it’s become clear via the agenda for the Council Meeting that they’ve pushed the date back to Easter 2028 for any passenger flights.
It’s clear that the mood of the general public is changing very rapidly and the pressure is ramping up on CDC, the mayors and even on Spanner’s as the mouthpiece spreading misinformation as fact
Egyptian King
Active Member
Well there goes a letter posted in all forums except save dsa, they want Ros to resign
- Jan 16, 2009
- 2,833
- 233
- Moderator
- #4,194
He’s too busy telling us how decisions made by Ros Jones to win another term as mayor could send the council into bankruptcy. Blithering idiots the lot of them.
If they can’t afford to cut and run now at a cost they claim will be around £50million, then how will they survive the many years of heavy losses, the constant requirement to inject tens of £millions into keeping the airport safe and compliant? It’s crossed the boundary from thinking they’re doing the right thing (perhaps naively) to blatantly knowing they’re doing the wrong thing but continuing anyway.
I see someone’s posted a rumour that negotiations on the lease with Peel have ground to a halt. If this is true then there is no chance of the S151 officer at SYMCA signing off on the Gainshare. Therefore the council would be on the hook for every penny this vanity project will cost.
I think 2028 is wishful thinking. They're unlikely to have got through the ACP by then never mind secured any airline contracts. CDC's pre-vote stunts have been a masterclass in how not to handle a crisis - threatening legal action against elected councillors who're asking legitimate questions, conjuring up phantom "major freight operators", and accidentally admitting the timeline has slipped to Easter 2028... it all reeks of a bunker mentality.
If Richard Tice will just pipe down about his mad CPO kung-fu manoeuvre then Jason Charity could save Doncaster's taxpayers millions. But Reform need to get their damned story straight. You can't run a political campaign based on the premise that an asset is a radioactive money pit, and then promise to use taxpayer money to forcibly buy that exact same pit from a billionaire property tycoon who doesn't want to sell it! It is political and economic illiteracy of the highest order. If the airport isn't viable then the airport isn't viable.
I think fortune will favour the first politician brave enough to tell people the truth. The airport isn't viable, and they have been misled, lied to, and used as a cash machine for political egos.
- Jan 16, 2009
- 2,833
- 233
- Moderator
- #4,196
I agree, but if only it was that simple. There are people in Doncaster who truly believe the airport should have been the Heathrow of the north. They truly believe it’s one of the longest runways in Europe and therefore it’s unique. They truly believe the old pub hours that Virgin wanted to fly from there but Peel told them to do one. This is quite a common belief and so it’s a pretty tough one to call for elected officials as they have to tip toe around it delicately. The belief that Peel sabotaged it is so engrained that to just come out and say it would have the conspiracy theorists out in force.
However what Reform are saying is strictly true. If there’s a private sector investor willing to take it on then try to get to the point where they can. They’re saying the airport isn’t viable under the current structure. They’re saying it may be viable if the private sector can buy the freehold.
A CPO won’t work, certainly not now. However if there’s demand for it then the private sector will step in and make Peel an offer they can’t refuse. If they don’t do this then the market has spoken. I’m not about to defend Reform but Jason Charity has called this one correctly.
I expect next week things will heat up further, I see that Charity has written another open letter in response to Ros Jones open letter.
Doncaster Sheffield Airport: Lease changes 'on hold' - as sticking point revealed
Negotiations to change Doncaster Sheffield Airport’s lease are yet to be resolved – as the clock ticks towards a crunch meeting which could cancel the project. Chris Burn and Ralph Blackburn report.
www.yorkshirepost.co.uk
Oh dear.
Egyptian King
Active Member
- Jan 16, 2009
- 2,833
- 233
- Moderator
- #4,198
I note that Peel have agreed in principle to remove the 2031 target and halved the 2036 targets moving the target in 2041 to 1.4 million ppa and 14k tonnes of freight. However what they seem to be expecting is that for it to be immune from the turnover clause then FlyDoncaster must be operated by the private sector. Clearly it is not and so the turnover clause applies.
People can speculate as to the reason for this, but I think Peel are fed up of being told they’re wrong. They know they’re right and they know the council don’t have a chance of turning things around so they understandably want compensating for the delay and dithering whilst they try to ‘save’ the ‘peoples airport’.
The European Cargo flights at Teesside were only suspended for about a week and have since resumed.
European Cargo entered into a multi million pound contract with Jaymac Solutions to provide warehousing for them.
Jaymac Solutions have leased a 1.8 acre plot of land at Teesside Airport to build a warehouse for the European Cargo contract and have started work on the plot.
So by the sounds of it European are in for the long haul at Teesside.
That news story about 80,000 Tonnes a year on upto 20 flights a week doesn't stack up.
That is 10 inbound and 10 outbound flights a week.
It would need to be an import and significant export operation to get anywhere near to that level.
The press release says they have been talking to a broker rather than directly to an airline. Also that they would be using warehousing in the vicinity of the airport, in other words it will be outside of the perimeter of the CDC lease site. So it would only be the ramp and aircraft fees that the airport/ CDC receive, while someone else gets the juicy bit of renting out the warehouse/ plot.
Oh good God...
www.yorkshirepost.co.uk
Tice is giving a masterclass on how to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory!
Why does a mad CPO move make a clearly nonviable airport viable? Let me help you out, Richard: it doesn't.
Strip away the lease question entirely. Imagine Tice gets his way and a Reform government acquires the freehold by CPO at whatever cost, the council's lease is extinguished, the public sector now owns DSA outright with no Peel involvement at all. The site is debt-free, the rent obligation is gone, the turnover share is gone, the volume break clauses are gone. What changes commercially? Nothing. None of the fundamental problems are caused by Peel owning the freehold; they are caused by the fact that the underlying market for a regional commercial passenger airport at this location doesn't support one. You still need carriers willing to base aircraft there. You still need passengers willing to fly from Doncaster rather than Manchester or East Midlands or Leeds Bradford. You still need a freight market that isn't completely dominated by East Midlands just down the road.
The lease has dominated the political conversation because it's the proximate problem, the document everyone can point to, the thing whose specific clauses generate quotable controversy. Farage is right: it's a disaster. But it's not actually the reason DSA can't reopen viably. It's just the reason the council's specific reopening attempt won't work. Even if the lease problem were magically solved tomorrow - by CPO, by surrender, by mutual variation, by whatever mechanism... the airport still wouldn't be commercially viable. The lease is the symptom of the underlying problem, not the cause.
I feel very sorry for Jason Charity. He's done a fantastic job of taking this mad project apart forensically and diligently. But he's being undermined by Tice and Farage who just wade in and mouth off without doing their homework.
"Utter twaddle": Richard Tice hits out at Labour over airport claim
Reform’s deputy leader Richard Tice has insisted a purchase of Doncaster Sheffield Airport “could be done quickly” with a combination of “political will and property nous”.
www.yorkshirepost.co.uk
Tice is giving a masterclass on how to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory!
Why does a mad CPO move make a clearly nonviable airport viable? Let me help you out, Richard: it doesn't.
Strip away the lease question entirely. Imagine Tice gets his way and a Reform government acquires the freehold by CPO at whatever cost, the council's lease is extinguished, the public sector now owns DSA outright with no Peel involvement at all. The site is debt-free, the rent obligation is gone, the turnover share is gone, the volume break clauses are gone. What changes commercially? Nothing. None of the fundamental problems are caused by Peel owning the freehold; they are caused by the fact that the underlying market for a regional commercial passenger airport at this location doesn't support one. You still need carriers willing to base aircraft there. You still need passengers willing to fly from Doncaster rather than Manchester or East Midlands or Leeds Bradford. You still need a freight market that isn't completely dominated by East Midlands just down the road.
The lease has dominated the political conversation because it's the proximate problem, the document everyone can point to, the thing whose specific clauses generate quotable controversy. Farage is right: it's a disaster. But it's not actually the reason DSA can't reopen viably. It's just the reason the council's specific reopening attempt won't work. Even if the lease problem were magically solved tomorrow - by CPO, by surrender, by mutual variation, by whatever mechanism... the airport still wouldn't be commercially viable. The lease is the symptom of the underlying problem, not the cause.
I feel very sorry for Jason Charity. He's done a fantastic job of taking this mad project apart forensically and diligently. But he's being undermined by Tice and Farage who just wade in and mouth off without doing their homework.
Similar threads
